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A cynical idealist; To Read Me Is to Know Me (Mostly)
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Member Since: 2/2007Last Seen: 11/28/2009

Samantha Power: Saving Zimbabwe

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I read this piece and went to seed it and instead when googling found this intriguing response to it . I'm curious which viewpoint best matches your own.

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5.7
{"commentId":2142052,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

The bigger problem with those who call for forcible regime change in Zimbabwe is not their faulty history; it is their utter indifference to consequences. Even if one could find a country prepared to invade Zimbabwe, such a war would probably cause Mugabe's bloodstained security forces (estimated to number 100,000) to butcher unarmed opposition politicians and their defenseless supporters and cause several million to flee to neighboring countries. It would also exacerbate the suspicions between countries in the north and those in the south, making it even more likely that developing countries (which account for the majority of U.N. member states) will dig in their heels in support of human rights abusers in Zimbabwe and beyond.

So what can be done? To start, U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon should appoint his predecessor, Kofi Annan, fresh from brokering a power-sharing deal for Kenya, as the U.N.'s envoy to Zimbabwe. One by one, those African and Western leaders who claim to be disgusted with Mugabe should announce that they bilaterally recognize the validity of the March 29 first-round election results, which showed the opposition winning 48% to 43%, though the margin was almost surely larger. The countries which do would make up the new "March 29 bloc" within the U.N. and would declare Morgan Tsvangirai the new President of Zimbabwe. They would then announce that Mugabe and the 130 leading cronies who have already been sanctioned by the West will not be permitted entry to their airports.

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  • 2 votes
Reply#1 - Tue Jul 8, 2008 11:43 AM EDT
{"commentId":2146473,"authorDomain":"TomJoad"}

Wow...my goodness. I'm not really sure I know which way this should go. After reading both articles, the quote "God will know his own" comes to mind, though.

This is a mess. I do NOT believe that it is the United States job to step in and intervene forcefully. If there was a concerted opposition that was organized, and was to declare independence, perhaps we could support them.

"Commerce with all, Alliance with none".

{"commentId":2146473,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"TomJoad"}
  • 2 votes
Reply#2 - Tue Jul 8, 2008 9:44 PM EDT
{"commentId":2146508,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}
I do NOT believe that it is the United States job to step in and intervene forcefully. If there was a concerted opposition that was organized, and

That's a very interesting comment for someone with the name of Tom Joad to make. What's the line about wherever injustice is occuring I'll be there?

{"commentId":2146508,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"sbutki"}
    #2.1 - Tue Jul 8, 2008 9:49 PM EDT
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    {"commentId":2146638,"authorDomain":"TomJoad"}

    Oh, brother...don't think I don't want to. If I could step in and twinkle my nose to make everything right with the world, I would in a heartbeat. It don't work that way, though. The American Revolution was BLOODY, but it was required for us to establish sovereignty, and show that we were serious. It requires people to have that yearning within their breast for a change to be made, and the conviction to fight and die for it.

    You let me hear that hungry, newborn baby cry for freedom, and scream for justice...you'll see me.

    {"commentId":2146638,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"TomJoad"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#3 - Tue Jul 8, 2008 10:27 PM EDT
    {"commentId":2146868,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

    Good response. Thanks for not minding my pointed question.

    {"commentId":2146868,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"sbutki"}
      #3.1 - Tue Jul 8, 2008 11:06 PM EDT
      {"commentId":2147726,"authorDomain":"TomJoad"}

      *snorts*
      You're gonna learn real fast that I don't necessarily worry about other people's feelings. You're gonna have to chill with this whole "Step Lightly" thing you've got going, at least with me. While it's appreciated, it just not needed.

      The whole point of me joining the site is to get things out of my head into a venue where others can see, and discuss it with me. I'd be more upset if you HAD questions, and wouldn't ask them.

      {"commentId":2147726,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"TomJoad"}
      • 1 vote
      #3.2 - Wed Jul 9, 2008 2:34 AM EDT
      Reply
      {"commentId":2151602,"authorDomain":"courts"}

      I've always liked Samantha Power. Her book "Problem from Hell: America and the Age of Genocide" is excellent and she provides a critical perspective on crimes against humanity, partiuclarly those occuring in the former Yugoslavia as it disintegrated in the 1990's.

      But this is by far and away NOT her best work.

      Many of her initial observations are correct: the death, torture, and displacement wrought upon Zimbabwe by Mugabe represents brutality, certainly not at its worst, but on a scale unfamiliar to many living in the West. Neither the multilateralists nor the moralists (as she calls them) have a working plan for Mugabe or Zimbabwe despite their protestations and condemnations. And she's right about the Iraq war--regardless of how badly political elements in the United States want to pretend that it was about humanitarian issues, it was framed in terms of weapons of mass destruction and September 11th and thus does not serve as a precedent for the kind of military intervention many would suggest for Zimbabwe.

      But her conclusions are problematic at best and ludicrous at worst.

      She suggests that the world publicly side either with Mugabe or with president elect Tsvangirai, creating a political and normative split between the two groups and allowing Tsvangirai to set up a government in exile with ambassadors abroad.

      And that's all well and good, but what's the point? As Dreyfuss explains, the world isn't likely to split into the pretty picture Power paints. On the one hand you have the apathy of an international community and its constituent parts to the situation in Zimbabwe given the socio-political-economic realities of world politics today. On the other, you have the potential for Zimbabwe to become a pawn in broader and completely unrelated political struggles. And through it all, what good is a government in exile going to do for the people of Zimbabwe who need more than and international debate on the legitimacy of their government.

      Dreyfuss calls this democracy promotion run wild and he's not all together wrong. While I'm not sure that his solution (to wait for Mugabe to die before taking action to resolve the situation) is best, I think he is wise to remind readers that the situation in Zimbabwe "hardly rises to the level of genocide." Indeed, those who would call Mugabe the "Hitler of Africa" would be well served to remember the horrors that have plagued the continent during the post-colonial era, horrors of which the African people remain painfully aware. We're not talking about violence that reaches the scope of Rwanda in 1994 (and if we were, I'd be shouting to put as many troops between those with the machetes and those being hacked to pieces as possible, consequences be damned as long as we stopped the bloodshed). While I'm all for intervening in episodes of genocide, we need to consider the precedent we would set if we intervened in a situation that does not as of yet meet justify a violation of state sovereignty by international forces.

      I'd love to be able to end with a counter proposal to that which Power suggests but I am for now lacking in policy suggestions. Though it falls along the lines of "multilateral hand wringing," I do find her proposal to send Kofi Annan as the UN envoy to Zimbabwe to see if he can try his hand at brokering a solution. In the mean time, I think Dreyfuss is wise: we should really try not to make things worse regardless if our intent is to make them better.

      {"commentId":2151602,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"courts"}
      • 1 vote
      Reply#4 - Wed Jul 9, 2008 2:45 PM EDT
      {"commentId":2152395,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

      Wow, when I asked you to drop by and leave a comment I was prepared for a "She is right" or "She is wrong" but instead I get a thoughtful eloquent intelligent response. Thanks so much!

      I was just surprised to see this column in Time, not exactly well known for thoughtful journalism although I was also impressed with the current cover package on Mark Twain particularly the piece about Twain and race by Stephen Carter.

      {"commentId":2152395,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"sbutki"}
        #4.1 - Wed Jul 9, 2008 4:03 PM EDT
        {"commentId":2156055,"authorDomain":"courts"}

        It's all about procrastinating on a dissertation proposal.

        This is my bread and butter--far easier at the moment than figuring out a research question pertaining to food security and safety that incorporates dimensions of multilateralism (Power would take this opportunity to comment on hand wringing).

        I hate writing research proposals.

        {"commentId":2156055,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"courts"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.2 - Wed Jul 9, 2008 11:35 PM EDT
        {"commentId":2156643,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

        What's the status of the book?

        {"commentId":2156643,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"sbutki"}
          #4.3 - Thu Jul 10, 2008 1:56 AM EDT
          {"commentId":2157973,"authorDomain":"courts"}

          I'll be in Ljubljana next week for a conference where we'll present a paper that could be described as the prospectus/introduction. When classes resume in August and my boss returns from Europe, we'll get back to full time writing (taking ever so brief breaks for teaching, food, and water).

          We hope to have a manuscript by May 1.

          Then I'll spend next summer writing the dissertation for which I am supposed to be currently composing a proposal and to which end I am stumped.

          {"commentId":2157973,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"courts"}
          • 1 vote
          #4.4 - Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:31 AM EDT
          {"commentId":2161070,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}
          breaks for teaching, food, and water).

          Man, tough conditions.

          \

          We hope to have a manuscript by May 1.

          Oh, when you spoke of it before I thought you meant May of this year. In that case, um, take your time and go wild and have some iced tea with that water.

          {"commentId":2161070,"threadId":"308929","contentId":"1648090","authorDomain":"sbutki"}
            #4.5 - Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:52 PM EDT
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